Loves charisma performances, movie stars at their peak, and trivia from Tarantino's circle. Champions Brad Pitt as the winner. Can't stand awards mistakes like The Artist winning, and he warns about the 'Oscars should wait five years' view. A sucker for 1960s details, driving scenes, and Boogie Nights real estate.
Stances
Brad Pitt won the movie
Oscars should be awarded five years later
Focus is underrated
Humor: Runs bits on movies he almost bought, fake research, and sports-style comparisons.
In their words
“I think Pitt won the movie.” (1:17:58)
“I think I'm the only one that likes focus.” (0:32:43)
Loves the mid-80s Eddie Murphy and the movie's cultural phenomenon, and has a clear soft spot for Lisa Eilbacher. Is a sucker for Hollywood-excess anecdotes (Simpson, cocaine, Rourke, Stallone) and for sports analogies. Has little patience for plot logic holes but loves list games and categories.
Stances
Eddie Murphy in 1984 was the biggest star in the world after Michael Jackson
Lisa Eilbacher is the Apex Mountain and the film's winner
The Eddie-Murphy-as-star what-if game (Top Gun) is a worthwhile question
Humor: Rapid-fire sports analogies (WAR, LeBron, Dion Waiters, Shawn Michaels) and mock-indignant asides.
Loves the lore of how a movie got made, the lists (casting what-ifs, recasting), and the 'unanswerable questions' category. Has little patience for Lawrence Tierney's acting or for Ebert missing on Tarantino. He remembers the 1992 Boston era of a movie that mattered and is a sucker for a heist.
Stances
Tarantino won the movie
Lawrence Tierney is bad (the 'Mike Francesa' bit)
Does not want new Reservoir Dogs content
Wants to see the heist, plays devil's advocate
Humor: Throws sports analogies, invents award names, and runs recurring bits like Roger Ebert and Felony Land.
In their words
“I love bank ice scenes.” (1:23:55)
“It's Tarantino, and I think all of those actors robbing a bank.” (1:23:22)
“Can I make the case for seeing the heist?” (1:23:18)
Loves ensemble casts and film-lineage framing, sports analogies (Dwight Gooden, Penny Hardaway), and the show's recurring awards. Wants a better soundtrack, and cannot stand the ending speech. Is a sucker for his wife and kids' opinions of the film.
Stances
Mean Girls is the best Lorne Michaels movie
Lohan's decline is like an athlete's lost career
Soundtrack and ending speech are weak
Humor: Dry, sports-and-family riffs, often teased by his co-hosts.
In their words
“that was like Dwight Gooden in 1985 on the Mets.” (0:27:59)
“I think this is the best Lauren Michaels movie.” (0:16:22)
Bill loves old-school sports myth-making, baseball nostalgia, the Natural's chill scene, and stat-nerd rabbit holes like reconstructing Roy Hobbs's season. He is picky about throwing motions and lineup logic, and is a sucker for the dugout-emptying slow-motion shot. He ranks Bull Durham/Hoosiers/Rocky near the top and finds slow hospital stretches in sports movies unbearable.
Stances
The Natural used to be the greatest sports movie but is now slower than he remembers
Every great sports movie needs a chill scene
Dislikes bad throwing motions on screen
Hospital detours in sports movies should be cut short
Roy Hobbs was a Bonds-level statistical machine, or worse
Humor: Dry, list-making sports-nerd riffs and reaching pop-culture asides (Bachelor, Harry Potter) delivered as if serious.
In their words
“My move with sports movies is like, get me out of the hospital as fast as possible.” (1:00:37)
“nothing drives me crazier than when somebody can't throw in a baseball movie.” (0:56:43)
Loves Gen X touchstones and basketball analogies; sticks up for Winona Ryder and Friends season one; mocks Troy-type guys and over-talky English majors. A sucker for half-assed internet research and awards-bit tradition.
Stances
Winona Ryder won the movie
Singles is a flawed but beloved sibling
Ben Stiller deserves credit
Humor: Rolls NBA references and mock-feuds into everything.
In their words
“I do look at her in a way, like, uh, like I look at some NBA players.” (0:32:14)
Loves sports-adjacent silliness, big broad comedy and quotable lines, and wedding toast chaos. Can't stand being wrong about movie trivia he has already litigated. A sucker for his own running categories and bits (Ebert, Joey Pants, Dion Waiters).
Stances
Roger Ebert is never to be trusted on comedies
Comedies of the era were a nice 6-7 year run
Open your movie with a wedding theory
Luke Wilson is not Harrison Ford
Humor: Deadpan rapid-fire teasing of co-hosts and mock-outrage, plus sports references.
In their words
“never to be trusted on comedies.” (0:15:17)
“This movie also nicely slots into my open your movie with a wedding theory.” (1:01:05)
Loves sports analogies, Kurt Russell and Pacino's Cruising, defends 90s movies like Fletch. Dislikes dated romance interludes like the picnic. A sucker for mustaches and Dana Wheeler-Nicholson.
Stances
Val Kilmer wins the movie
Wyatt Earp is the rival, Tombstone is more entertaining
Cruising is incredible
Cut the 12-minute theater scene
Humor: Rapid-fire sports comparisons and teasing his cohosts.
In their words
“I think this movie is the perfect microcosm of both of their careers.” (0:12:28)
“I just don't come to Tombstone for picnics” (0:29:44)
Loves old-school and 5 o'clocker action, Seagal, Stallone, Nick Cage, and movies that know exactly what they are. Can't stand over-explained worldbuilding or sequels that give the hero a known villain. A sucker for the Neeson comeback and for ranking things by era.
Stances
Taken is the perfect 5 o'clocker
Taken 2 is not better than the first
Neeson is the Apex Mountain of the movie
The first Taken works because there is no main villain
Humor: Deadpan nitpicking, escalating sports analogies, and long self-deprecating dad stories.
In their words
“I just like watching movies that know exactly what they are.” (0:32:10)
“I don't think it's a John Wick 2 situation where John Wick 2 is actually somehow better than John Wick one, or we could at least have the debate.” (0:42:12)
Loves big star-driven movies and sets the show's categories; adores the Wahlberg and Baldwin scenes, Boston flavor and the crazy cast what-ifs. Can't stand Nicholson's performance here, implausible plot points and the rat. A sucker for 'that guy' actors, Goodfellas and Boston details.
Stances
The Departed is a Hall of Famer because it is flawed and fun
Leo won the movie, Nicholson loses it
Costello should have been Pacino
Damon's Boston accent beats Wahlberg's
Scorsese's Stones fetish is funny
Humor: Deadpan nitpicking, jokes about plot holes and trivia, rapid mock-outrage.
In their words
“This is a perfect rewatchable because it is a great bad movie.” (0:12:23)
Calls Spielberg the greatest director ever but is skeptical of his late period and Munich. Loves Jaws, Raiders, and E.T. through his kids, and measures movies by whether kids can stay with them. Distrusts the calculating, career-minded side of Spielberg and Spielberg's DreamWorks hedging.
Stances
Spielberg's first 15 years are the greatest career stretch ever
His recent work is solid but not special
Spielberg is 'calculating' where Mann or Coppola are obsessive
Judges movies by whether his kids can watch them
Humor: Wry and teasing; leans on sports analogies (LeBron, Popovich) and bits like 'hit by a car in 1986'.
In their words
“if you just got hit by a car at the peak of your career, how would people remember you?” (0:51:08)
“I judge everything by my kids who have, you know, 21st century ADD with pop culture.” (1:00:09)
Their shows' recurring bits
Running bits, not opinions; a critic read aloud is cited, not present.
The Big Picture
Drafts: Hosts and guests draft films in rounds; every pick is a recommendation with an argument.
Hall of Fame: A star's or director's best, ranked and argued.
Countdowns: Ranked lists, top five or top ten.
The Rewatchables
Apex Mountain: The moment a star peaks; where on the mountain a performance sits.
Who Won the Movie: The hosts name the person who came out of the film best off.
The Ebert review: Roger Ebert's original review and star rating read aloud. Ebert is cited, never on the show.
Casting what-ifs: Who was almost cast, or who should have been.
Most rewatchable scene: The scene each host would stop on while flipping channels.
Aged best / aged worst: What holds up and what does not.
Picking Nits: The little things in a film the hosts love that they don't think totally work: the nits.
Double feature: The film each host would pair it with; a programming pick.
craft (craft):
Explosions in the Sky → Kid Cudi.
Rates the Explosions in the Sky bus-ride cue as the best needle drop, setting it beside Kid Cudi's 'Pursuit of Happiness'.
“I have that as kid cutty pursuit of happiness where best needle drop.”
what-if (what-if):
Matt Damon → Friday Night Lights (2004 film).
A mid-90s Matt Damon, as in School Ties, would have been ideal for Winchell, but he was too old by 2004.
“And what I realized was that this would have been an amazing mid 90s Matt Damon part.”
verdict (verdict):
Friday Night Lights (2004 film) → The Longest Yard.
Bill's football-movie ranking: Longest Yard first, then Friday Night Lights, North Dallas Forty, Titans, Rudy and Any Given Sunday in some order.
lineage (lineage):
Pulp Fiction → Pulp Fiction imitators.
The Royale-in-Paris, Amsterdam conversation is the most parodied and copied stretch of screenwriting of the last 30 years.
“Yeah. I would argue this is the most ripped off four and a half minutes of screenwriting in the past 30 years.”
lineage (lineage):
Pulp Fiction → Lee Majors.
The setup of Vincent taking the boss's wife out echoes a Hollywood story about Lee Majors asking someone to take Farrah Fawcett out while he was away.
industry (industry):
Quentin Tarantino → Reality Bites.
Reality Bites got My Sharona for its convenience store scene; licensing chose it over the gang rape scene, and Tarantino says he is glad.
“Reality Bites also wanted it for the convenience store scene.”
programming (programming):
Twister → Apollo 13.
The 1995 summer slate (Crimson Tide, Die Hard, Braveheart, Batman Forever, Apollo 13) was when Hollywood began slamming mid-May to July 4.
“Batman forever, Apollo 13th all before July 4th.”
programming (programming):
Twister → Mission: Impossible.
1996 is when the studios locked in the early-May-to-July-4 summer blockbuster calendar: Twister, Mission: Impossible, The Rock, Eraser, Independence Day.
industry (industry):
Twister → The Cable Guy.
Chris pushes back that The Cable Guy, a notorious failure, still made 104 million, and Twister made 495 million.
industry (industry):
Twister → Twisters.
Twister and K-Hive both came back on Twitter in the same week ahead of the sequel, and the original is on Max.
“And Twister is on, I think it's on the Max app, but it's just it just feels very omnipresent right now.”
career (career):
Bill Paxton → True Lies.
In the 90s Paxton had important non-lead roles in True Lies, Tombstone and Apollo 13 before finally leading Twister.
career (career):
Bill Paxton → Sam Neill.
Like Sam Neill, Paxton did not become a star because the audience remembers the spectacle (storms, dinosaurs), not the lead.
career (career):
Bill Paxton → Kevin Bacon.
Paxton belongs to the Kevin Bacon, Bill Pullman, Kiefer Sutherland tier; the third guy in the cocktail with Tom Hanks in Apollo 13.
career (career):
Todd Field → Eyes Wide Shut.
Todd Field as an actor is an absolute banger in Eyes Wide Shut, Twister and Sleep with Me, then directed only three unique movies.
“Nick in eyes wide shut, twister, and sleep with me.”
verdict (verdict):
Twister → Roger Ebert.
Ebert gave 2.5 stars, saying loud dumb escapist entertainment works but not for thinkers; this became a running joke later.
craft (craft):
Twister → Van Halen.
The hail tornado is dubbed the Van Halen storm for its needle drop, a song that works in the movie but would not make a Van Halen playlist.
theme (theme):
Twister → The Shining.
The drive-in tornado scene works because a tornado tears the screen while the audience watches The Shining, a frightening movie with a real threat behind it.
“there's something coming behind that that's actually fucking frightening and it just starts ripping.”
theme (theme):
Twister → Heat.
A joke that Chris Ryan lost the town its treasury of cinematic knowledge when blown away, still hadn't seen Heat, which hadn't been made yet.
craft (craft):
Twister → Eric Clapton.
The most inexplicable music choice is Dusty watching an Eric Clapton video, which the speaker writes off as product placement.
“The most inexplicable song is just when Dusty's watching the Eric Clapton video from Motherless Child.”
contrast (contrast):
Helen Hunt → Steven Seagal.
Helen Hunt's running through the cornfield is likened to Seagal and not athletic despite Quarterback Princess.
“I'm just not happy with the running in this movie.”
what-if (what-if):
Twister → Steven Spielberg.
Spielberg was initially attached to direct, as he was for every movie in the 90s, before Jan de Bont took over.
“Spielberg initially attached to direct, which I think was the case for every single movie in the 90s”
what-if (what-if):
Bill Paxton → Tom Hanks.
Hanks read for Bill, passed, and suggested Paxton; Hanks even had wardrobe ready, so Paxton got the role via a big star.
what-if (what-if):
Twister → Sally Field.
Casting a bigger actress for Aunt Meg is floated with Sally Field, Ellen Burstyn, Shirley MacLaine and Debra Winger.
“Who was available at? Ellen Bursten? Sally Field? Coming off Forrest Gump?”
career (career):
Jami Gertz → The Lost Boys.
The guess for Jami Gertz's apex mountain is Less Than Zero or The Lost Boys, when she was one of the biggest under-25 actresses.
“It felt like she was one of the biggest under 25 female actresses on the rise.”
theme (theme):
Twister → Armageddon.
The panel debates whether Twister is the apex 90s disaster movie against Armageddon, Outbreak, Dante's Peak, Deep Impact, Independence Day; natural disasters only.
“So so I consider disaster movies to be natural disaster movies.”
contrast (contrast):
Twister → San Andreas.
Modern disaster movies fail by casting the Rock, who is never in peril, instead of normal-looking actors like Adam Driver.
what-if (what-if):
Twister → Denzel Washington.
Denzel is too cool, like Charlton Heston as Brody in Jaws, so nobody believes he would lose to a tornado.
what-if (what-if):
Bill Paxton → Aliens.
A proposed category: actors reprising a different character from their own filmography; Paxton just doing Hudson from Aliens and screaming Cows.
industry (industry):
Twister → Titanic.
Twister started a playbook of putting not-yet-A-list leads in a spectacle, which Titanic and later Star Wars followed.
career (career):
Michael Douglas → Kathleen Turner.
Douglas and Turner were the Hepburn and Tracy of the 80s and seemed headed for 20 movies together; Roses was the last.
“Michael Douglas and Kathleen Turner were the Hepburn and Tracy of the 80s”
career (career):
Kathleen Turner → The Man with Two Brains.
Turner was in Steve Martin's The Man with Two Brains, not a great movie but one a Martin completist enjoys.
“she's in Man with Two Brains, which is not a great movie”
career (career):
Kathleen Turner → Who Framed Roger Rabbit.
Turner voiced Jessica Rabbit in Roger Rabbit, a hugely influential movie, in the same 80s run.
“She was the voice in who framed Roger Rabbit, which was a massive deal”
career (career):
Michael Douglas → Fatal Attraction.
Douglas's hit run from 87 includes Fatal Attraction, Wall Street, Black Rain, Roses, Basic Instinct and more.
“And then from 87 on when he rips off Fatal Attraction, Wall Street, Black Rain, War of the Roses, shining through.”
industry (industry):
Michael Douglas → The War of the Roses.
Douglas's producer background gave him a spot-on commercial taste that produced rewatchable classics.
“Michael Douglas, because he thought, like, a producer and had this whole producer background”
career (career):
Danny DeVito → Michael Douglas.
DeVito was a big 80s star who was always the third wheel with Douglas and Turner, and was doing the Schwarzenegger movies.
industry (industry):
Phil Collins → The War of the Roses.
Phil Collins wrote a song for Roses that was supposed to be in it but took too long and the offer was withdrawn.
“Phil Collins wrote a song called Something Happened on the Way to Heaven that was supposed to be in this.”
career (career):
Richard Gere → An Officer and a Gentleman.
Internal Affairs and An Officer and a Gentleman are probably the final two for Gere's best performance.
“It's this and it's officer and a gentleman probably in the final two.”
contrast (contrast):
Internal Affairs → Ghost.
The same movie could be made with Ghost's dirty banker and the drug dealer; the cop element is not necessary because it is about power and manipulation.
“So remember how in Ghost he was the dirty banker that was funneling money for the drug dealer, whatever?”
craft (craft):
Internal Affairs → Lethal Weapon 3.
The unfinished Granada Hills development recalls construction sites in Lethal Weapon 3 and other action crime movies.
“Because when you think about, I guess it's lethal weapon three.”
what-if (what-if):
Nancy Travis → Annabella Sciorra.
The movie would be better if Sciorra and Travis swapped roles because the dark Italian-Latin side would contrast with Peck.
“What if, is this movie better if Annabelle Shiora and Nancy Travis swap roles?”
fun, about
Jay Barrishell:
Daily Beast interview: Jay said he and Jonah didn't get along and found Jonah's compliment scene exhausting, then loved the rough cut.
fun, about
Rihanna:
Slapped Michael Cera for real; Cera asked if he could slap her butt and she said only if she could hit back; multiple takes left him lying down.
“he asked Rihanna if he could actually slap her butt and she said, if I can hit you back.”
fun, about
Alec Baldwin:
On set Baldwin refused to shave his beard, so Bill Pullman was lined up to replace him; he then shaved but stopped talking to the director for the shoot.
“And then won't talk to the director for the rest of the shoot.”
fun, about
David Mamet:
Art Linson's book: in the pitch an executive objected that nobody roots for a rich guy, so Mamet added the affair and the cuckold angle.
fun, about
Bart the Bear:
Bart's filmography: Legends of the Fall, The Great Outdoors, 12 Monkeys, Grizzly Adams, presented at the 1998 Academy Awards.
“He was a presenter at the Academy Awards in 1998”
fun, about
Paul Bettany:
Balcony speech: fear of falling is really fear that you might jump; then the money-left-after-taxes run with 76,520 on hookers.
fun, about
Margin Call:
Casting what-ifs: Irons role first offered to Ben Kingsley, Tim Robbins and Billy Crudup passed, Carla Gugino was to play Demi Moore's part.
“The Jeremy Ions ions world was originally offered too.”
fun, about
Misery:
Goldman wanted the job because of King's foot-chopping scene; George Roy Hill could not direct it, and Reiner and Scheinman softened it to the ankle-breaking hobbling.
“The lapping scene was gone now forever replaced by the ankle breaking scene.”
fun, about
Judd Apatow:
Bill reads the Rudd character as a stand-in for Judd, with Apatow's own wife and kids on screen: 'Judd's really going through something'.
fun, about
Beverly Hills Cop II:
A Premiere magazine piece says the script was rewritten dozens of times, finalized three weeks before production, with a 10-week shoot stretching to 20.
“Cop 2 ate up the energy of 2 executive producers, 2 producers, one director, 6 writers, and various productive production executives of personnel at Paramount.”
fun, about
Brigitte Nielsen:
Most rewatchable scene pick: the jewelry-store robbery with the robber calling out elapsed time and time left.
“If a movie features a scene where there is a robbery and the robber is calling out the amount of time that they've been in there and how much time they have left, probably going to be a rewatchable at some point.”
fun, about
Beverly Hills Cop II:
Murphy's original pitch was a Testarossa and a Beverly Hills gun club; the studio first considered England/Scotland Yard and a TV series, but Murphy refused both.
“Murphy's ideas was that that Folish should have a testeras, Rosa Ferrari, and that there should be something at the Beverly Hills gun club.”
fun, about
Tony Scott:
Scott flew to New Jersey to meet Murphy, shot pool, then Murphy vanished mid-rematch and sent his boys to say Scott was fine with him.
“Scott recalls shooting some pool with Murphy. who won the 1st game, then disappeared in the middle of a rematch.”
fun, about
Eddie Murphy:
Murphy arrived with a huge trailer and an entourage including his Uncle Ray, brother Charlie, cousin Ray Jr., Fruity, and a 21-year-old valet, and was late all the time, then ad-libbed.
“he was late all the time, according to one of the crew.”
fun, about
Beverly Hills Cop II:
Eddie Murphy himself called it the most successful mediocre picture in history, a half-assed rehash that was less spontaneous. Both hosts disagree and say they love it.
“Beverly Hills cop 2 was probably the most successful mediocre picture in history.”
fun, about
Eddie Murphy:
Murphy bought a $65,000 Porsche at lunch when depressed, and fought producers to keep the Ferrari from the movie; the producers' spokesman denied they ever gave him one.
“Eddie may have bought a red Ferrari, but Don and Jerry never gave him one.”
fun, about
Beverly Hills Cop II:
Most rewatchable scene: Axel at the gun club pleading for his daughters Monique and Unique; Simmons calls it a fucking classic.
“I'd like to see my kids, Monique and Unique again, fucking classic.”
fun, about
Beverly Hills Cop II:
Best quote candidate: the Gerald Ford lookalike in the strip club; Simmons says he still doesn't know why it's funny after all these years.
fun, about
Tony Scott:
On the armored-truck city deposit robbery: Scott takes off his shirt, rubs body butter on his arms and does action-sequence curls for three minutes.
“Tony's like, takes off his shirt, rubs his arms with body butter, and just fucking does some curls for us for about 3 minutes.”
fun, about
Beverly Hills Cop II:
Ages the best: the opening song 'Shakedown' by Bob Seger; Simmons wants more theme songs thematically drawn from the movie, like running away from crime in the city.
“We just don't have, we used to do things in this country.”
fun, about
Beverly Hills Cop II:
Ages the best: Producer Craig plays the Faltermeyer opening and Simmons says it makes him want to rob a jewelry store; they plan to end pods with a 45-second Craig song.
fun, about
Hugh Hefner:
First movie ever filmed at the Playboy Mansion; Hefner had said no film, then supposedly found a film reflecting his values. Paul Reiser also reads Playboy Sisters in three scenes.
“Reiser, he's reading Playboy Sisters, 112 pages of Sexy Siblings.”
fun, about
Beverly Hills Cop II:
Casting what-if: Simmons wants Geena Davis in the thin role of Bogomil's daughter Jan, and Ryan wants Lisa Bonet as a strip-club character killed to fuel Axel's revenge, an 11-minute sidetrack.
“It's just 2 phone calls and then she's like, I've solved where this guy's visa came from?”