Loves Killer's Kiss and 1950s noir and studio-era trivia, and is happy to run the box office game from deep knowledge. Dislikes padded plotless first films, and is quick to point out what a first film is missing.
Stances
Killer's Kiss is a blast and more romantic than expected
Fear and Desire reads like a poem not a story
50s box office lists are full of forgotten programmers
Humor: Dry, British-inflected asides and fake-outraged bits.
David prefers Burton's Batman Returns and Batman Begins as his top live-action Batmans, and is more lukewarm than Griffin on Lego Batman, finding the middle stretch with other IP monotonous. He loves Lego as a kid (Ice Planet) and now covets expert-level Star Wars sets. He enjoys comedy-world gossip about Ellie Kemper and Michael Cera.
Stances
Not his favorite Batman movie because of the invading IP stuff
The middle stretch with the other villains is boring
Returns and Begins are his two favorite live-action Batmans
Humor: Dry teasing of Griffin and Ben, and self-aware dad jokes about buying Lego for his baby.
In their words
“Which have always been my 2 favorite live action Batman movies.” (0:00:55)
“So I think we just got through the stretch of the movie that I think is a little boring.” (1:14:42)
David asks the commonsense questions the film refuses to answer and loves a deadpan Occam's razor defense. He is a dad, a sports-box-office guy, and a sucker for a movie-history comparison, but he draws the line at being asked to like this.
Stances
Why would they not just skip the deal
Wants simple explanations (Occam's razor)
Calls Old Dogs a bad movie but finds it fascinating
Humor: Dry logic questions and quick film-reference comparisons.
Admires the film's production value and its comedic precision, and is the one reading box office data and quizzing. Can't stand the self-serious trend in Batman movies; a sucker for 60s epics and trivia about directors and casts.
Stances
Batman movies have raced toward self-serious credibility
Burton and Schumacher inherited the West show's tone and branding
Humor: Dry factual one-liners and pop-culture deflation.
In their words
“I think this is the the oldest film we've ever covered on this podcast.” (0:00:48)
“It's been this race to self-serious credibility.” (1:04:50)
Wanted to do Lean personally and expected Welles to win. Mild about Mel Brooks, worried about repetitiveness, but admires his cultural importance. Loves Planet of the Apes.
Stances
Fears Brooks may get repetitive
Pro-Lean
Humor: Dry and teasing with the Chip bit.
In their words
“I also would love to do lean personally.” (0:11:11)
A longtime defender who saw In the Cut at 17 and was 'well known for being the In the Cut is good person'. Loves Unfaithful, Addicted to Love and Kevin Bacon-style character work, and sweats the details of box-office history. (Speaker labels are inferred; the transcript has none.)
Stances
He has always been an In the Cut fan
2003 was a great year for commercial and art cinema alike
Humor: Rattles off box-office lists and trivia and teases Griffin about his taste.
In their words
“I was well known for being the in the cut is good person.” (0:09:26)
“Okay, fine. I love that movie.” (0:13:04)
“I was watching on Netflix out of convenience.” (0:52:44)
Likes campy, genre-aware Twilight and enjoyed New Moon for its challenges; likes old-timey vampire vs werewolf action and well-made lore. Hates inert scenes and kissing-free tension, and gets irritated by clutter/poor casting. A sucker for actors with dirtbag charisma and trivia on actors' careers. Attribution partly inferred; many lines unattributed.
Stances
New Moon is better
Casting of Riley/Victoria is the problem
Condon will lean into camp
Humor: Quick one-liners and pop-culture trivia.
In their words
“I will say, I am enjoying this old timey vampire versus werewolf action.” (0:45:48)
“Because I gotta tell you, this one, this one was a big knot.” (2:21:34)
A critic who has seen Covenant at a press screening and on 4K; likes Prometheus and Scott's ambition. Pays attention to who composed and wrote, and to the Alien franchise's lineage. Likes the film's double-Fassbender conceit and the stranger parts.
Stances
Scott hates humans and rich people
The two androids are the film's best part
Covenant is half Prometheus sequel, half studio-requested Alien
Humor: Sarcastic asides and escalating bits about David and the fake franchises.
In their words
“I have rewatched this like once since theaters.” (1:23:01)
Knows the production history cold (Danny Boyle, Whedon, Jeunet) and loves practical effects, animatronics, big industrial sets and character actors like Brad Dourif and Ron Perlman. Has a lifelong crush on Winona Ryder. Cannot stand when a movie stops to talk, or generic villains like Michael Wincott's.
Stances
Whedon and Jeunet were a terrible match
The first hour is fun, the talky middle is weak
The newborn alien is a big swing worth admiring
All the Alien movies are worth defending
Humor: Dry film-nerd with deadpan joke elaboration, especially mock Deadline headlines.
In their words
“I mean, I guess I have such an incredible weakness for Winona Rider, as you know, Griffin.” (0:37:58)
“I think alien movies need to be gnarly.” (0:23:09)
Defends Alien 3 as moody and Fincher-flavored but admits it is unrelentingly bleak. Loves the mythos of the Weyland-Yutani company and Sigourney Weaver. Cares about box-office history.
Stances
Alien 3 makes a defensible creative choice with a prison setting
The movie is flawed by a missing thesis about the prison
A box-office run-down belongs in every episode
Humor: Dry delivery; sets up bits with straight-faced trivia and plays the straight man to Griffin.
In their words
“I love the mythos of alien.” (1:53:27)
“Uh, yeah, it fell off 65% in its 2nd weekend.” (2:09:50)
Admires Fallout and McQuarrie's craft, loves Hitchcock-style set pieces and tight villains. Dislikes bloated plot mechanics and has strong feelings about Alec Baldwin's career.
Stances
Fallout may top Rogue Nation on rewatch
Rogue Nation's opera sequence is the series high point
Humor: Dry asides, comedy-point awards and speaking about England from lived experience.
In their words
“I did grow up in Britain, and this is the place where I grew up.” (1:35:19)
A native Upper West Sider (also raised partly in England) who knows the neighborhood the film is set in. Loves Meg Ryan's weirder rom-coms (Addicted to Love, Practical Magic) and award-season history. Likes to run quizzes and box-office games.
Stances
The Upper West Side is the film's real subject
Meg Ryan has more range than Hanks
Awards-season trivia reveals how rom-coms are dismissed
Humor: Trivia ambusher; pairs deadpan facts with pop-culture gossip.
In their words
“So I grew up on 89th and Amsterdam.” (0:24:20)
“David has many times tried to sell me on the idea of doing a Griffin Dunn miniseries because he so badly wants to cover her to love.” (1:21:31)
“So can you tell me the 5 nominees for best performance by an actor in a comedy or musical at the 1998 Golden Globes?” (1:42:56)
Runs the box office quiz and tracks the stars' careers across the 1990s (Matthau, Lemmon, Kudrow, Ryan). Likes the Ephron sensibility but finds this film lacking structure; loves Pitch Black context and sci-fi bargains. Cannot stand sentimental farewells like Tuesdays with Morrie.
Stances
The film needs a romantic subplot or tighter structure
Matthau's performance is the best thing in the movie
Tuesdays with Morrie is the worst film ever made
Humor: Dry, exasperated riffs on Hollywood economics and casting; sparring with Griffin over box office guesses.
In their words
“Okay, it's the worst film ever made.” (0:44:25)
“You can't fake rich LA, right?” (1:09:10)
“Anyway, the number one movie at the box office this weekend was the whole 9 yards.” (1:18:31)
Prefers the practical, performed experience over the movie and calls the film like eating mayonnaise from the jar. A sucker for shaggy gags and ironic Oscar talk.
Stances
The experience was better than the movie
Universal's rental model will work on desperate parents
Humor: Deadpan put-downs and analogies, such as the Olive Garden review.
In their words
“I think I tapped out at a certain point.” (0:45:34)
Defends the movie's big set pieces (speeder bike chase, the Emperor and Luke scenes) while admitting the structure is sloppy; loves Akbar and Harrison Ford's career lore. Hates the Emperor's flat conception and the late sibling reveal. Likes box office trivia and games.
Stances
Jedi has the weakest finish of the three
The Emperor is uncompelling as a character
Ewoks are fine; the problem is what Han and Leia do
Was a kid who thought Jedi was the best until a rewatch
Humor: Dry, tired asides and playful teasing of Griffin and Ben, getting punchier as the beers accumulate.
In their words
“Griffin thought that way until he was like 27 years old.” (1:49:51)
“I think that's the other major difference.” (1:00:53)
Critic-ish and enthusiastic: Portrait of a Lady on Fire is his movie of the year; loves Ashes Is Purest White, Dark Waters, Ad Astra, Knives Out. Values movie-star performances and gets visibly fond of overlooked films like Peterloo and Triple Frontier.
Stances
Portrait of a Lady on Fire is the year's best
Dark Waters will be re-evaluated; the film is underrated
Prefers Toy Story 4 more than expected
Humor: Dry; plays straight man and throws in lines like 'Absolute 0 Popes' reactions and the Becker running joke.
In their words
“That has been the movie for me all year.” (1:09:50)
Champion of Infinity War: loves how Thanos is the real protagonist and how the movie argues for caring about every character. Hates the idea that deaths must be final to matter, and loves actors' craft and box-office trivia. Nervous flyer who loves a road trip to Toronto.
Stances
Thanos is the protagonist and the film is about every character mattering
Killing characters is uninteresting; the loss is what counts
The MCU's crossover structure is a cinematic accomplishment
Humor: Deadpan overshare and cheerful self-roast, especially about his fear of flying.
In their words
“I'm a very nervous flyer.” (0:00:52)
“I think killing characters is uninteresting and usually, like, I just don't care for it.” (2:26:40)
Loves rules, systems and well-set-up action (Infinity Stone rules, Gamora's type-A bossiness, clear action goals); a box-office and Marvel-billing obsessive who makes spreadsheets. Respects Lee Pace's operatic villain and Drax. Dislikes Marvel's post-production sheen and the 'house style' gray. Speaker attribution is inferred from the room's teasing and is uncertain.
Stances
Lee Pace's Ronan is a great, underrated Marvel villain
Marvel's color grading is bad but the art direction is good
Humor in Guardians works as a storytelling aid
Humor: Gets teased as a bossy rules-loving spreadsheet guy and plays along with deadpan.
In their words
“I like type A tightwad characters.” (0:27:52)
“I like the Infinity Stone stuff because I like rules.” (1:10:54)
Their shows' recurring bits
Running bits, not opinions; a critic read aloud is cited, not present.
The Big Picture
Drafts: Hosts and guests draft films in rounds; every pick is a recommendation with an argument.
Hall of Fame: A star's or director's best, ranked and argued.
Countdowns: Ranked lists, top five or top ten.
Blank Check with Griffin & David
The box office game: Guessing the film's opening weekend and what it was up against.
The sung theme: "Blank Check with Griffin and David", sung; the transcriber garbles it.
Their claims
Showing 401–500 of 1,091 claims.
lineage (lineage):
Eraserhead → The Meteors.
The Meteors are named among the bands who covered the Eraserhead song.
career (career):
Jack Fisk → Killers of the Flower Moon.
Fisk's latest Oscar nomination was for building a town for Flower Moon, but he lost to Poor Things.
career (career):
Frederick Elmes → Blue Velvet.
Elmes replaced the first cinematographer on Eraserhead and later shot Blue Velvet, Wild at Heart and worked with Ang Lee.
“shot blue velvety, shot wild at heart, works with Ang Li.”
craft (craft):
Pleasantville → Randy Newman.
Pleasantville is described with a tree catching fire under the swelling strings of Randy Newman, who scored it.
“It teaches his mom how to masturbate and then a tree catches on fire to the swelling strings of Randy Newman.”
lineage (lineage):
H.R. Giger → Eraserhead.
Giger called Eraserhead one of his big eye-opening moments, and Lynch later accused him of stealing his ideas.
“H.R. Gigger, loves this movie, says it's one of his, like, you know, big eye-opening moments in his life”
industry (industry):
Ben Barenholtz → Pink Flamingos.
Barenholtz of Libra Films, a midnight-movie distributor, had already handled Pink Flamingos before he bought Eraserhead.
“He had distributed like pink flamingos, the John Waters movie.”
industry (industry):
Ben Barenholtz → Eraserhead.
Barenholtz phoned to buy the film halfway through a screening and it played 15 to 20 cities by word of mouth.
“Halfway through the screening, he gets on the phone and is like, by this movie.”
craft (craft):
The 13th Warrior → Tom Savini.
McTiernan's R-rated reshoots bolted on gore effects in the vein of Tom Savini, though there are not many of them.
“just doing like Tom Savini gags, which, yeah, there aren't even that many.”
people (people):
Michael Crichton → Jerry Goldsmith.
Crichton, who took control of the cut, replaced Graeme Revell's score with one from Jerry Goldsmith, whom he called his guy.
“We're getting Jerry Goldsmith, who's like my guy and we'll give you swelling orchestral medieval music”
people (casting origin):
Prometheus → The Killer.
Fincher said at the Q&A that seeing Prometheus made him note Fassbender as a good sociopath for later.
“I go to see Prometheus and I go, hmm, sociopath.”
people (casting-director crush):
Arliss Howard → Men Don't Leave.
Laray Mayfield told David she has had a crush on Arliss Howard since Men Don't Leave.
“She cited this movie that he's in as like a romantic lead, I think.”
unmapped (documentary then drama):
The Battle Over Citizen Kane → RKO 281.
David says the documentary was then remade, and he watched both; he means RKO 281.
“Battle over Citizen Kane is also the excellent documentary that then was remake.”
unmapped (history as Shakespeare):
The Social Network → Mank.
Sorkin's Social Network uses Zuckerberg like Shakespeare riffs on kings, as the Mank makers use film history.
“I think, like, uh, the Finchers and Eric Roth and old men are all doing the same thing here”
people (same writer-director question):
Mank → The Social Network.
Griffin says Mank is a talkie without the entertaining dialogue of The Social Network.
“It's a talkie movie, but a talking movie without having the kind of like wildly entertaining dialogue of a social network.”
unmapped (Netflix black and white):
Mank → Roma.
Netflix is where you go for a script nobody else wants and for a black and white movie: Roma, Mank, Blonde, Maestro.
“Not only is Netflix the place you go to for your script that nobody else wants to buy, but it's where you go and you want to make your black and white movie.”
unmapped (black and white):
Mank → Nebraska.
Studios' old resistance to black and white (TV, VHS, foreign sales) shown by Nebraska's regrade for Paramount.
“Especially when so much of Studios opposition to black and white movies was it doesn't play on TV.”
craft (score pastiche):
Max Steiner → Trent Reznor.
Reznor and Ross's score is called a self-conscious recreation of 1940s scoring, as if doing Max Steiner or Miklos Rozsa.
“It's obviously like a self-conscious recreation of something, but to just be like, yeah, I'm doing Max Steiner.”
unmapped (rosebud theory):
RKO 281 → Mank.
David asks whether Mank's denial of the Rosebud explanation answers RKO 281; Sean says it is a really popular theory instead.
“Do you think that's just directly responding to a 20-year-old HBO TV movie”
unmapped (drunk movies):
The Lost Weekend → Leaving Las Vegas.
Speakers list drunk-protagonist films: Leaving Las Vegas, The Way Back, the Hangover trilogy.
“There aren't enough movies these days about guys who get hammered drunk.”
unmapped (gaffer to DP):
Erik Messerschmidt → Ferrari.
Gone Girl's gaffer is now the director of photography on Ferrari (and Mindhunter, Mank, The Killer).
unmapped (hired a lighting mind):
Michael Mann → Erik Messerschmidt.
Mann told the speaker he likes Messerschmidt because he was a gaffer and cinematography is lighting.
“And he was like, you know why I like that guy because he was a gaffer. And to me, cinematography is all lighting and no one understands lighting anymore.”
theme (attitude / genre):
The Social Network → Dumb Money.
Dumb Money has no pretension of being the next Social Network but its attitude is that of the earlier film; the speakers say the film became a genre.
“there's nothing about that movie's attitude that's like, this is the next social network, but the attitude of that movie is like social network.”
lineage (closest descendant):
The Social Network → Blackberry.
Blackberry is named as the only movie to come close to The Social Network in the 13 years since.
“I think Blackberry is the only thing that has come close and then now 13 years since this movie came out.”
people (shared writer):
The Social Network → Moneyball.
Moneyball is set aside as a Sorkin script written after The Social Network, so it does not count as a successor.
“Don't count those, right? Because those are Sorkin scripts.”
people (shared writer):
The Social Network → Steve Jobs.
Steve Jobs is set aside as a Sorkin script written after The Social Network, so it does not count as a successor.
“Don't count those, right? Because those are Sorkin scripts.”
lineage (ripped off):
The Social Network → The Big Short.
David says The Big Short is the most obvious movie ripping off The Social Network, and that people do not make the connection enough.
“I think the big short, which is not a movie I love, is the most obvious movie that's ripping off the social network, even though people maybe don't make that connection enough.”
lineage (loose adaptation):
The Accidental Billionaires (Ben Mezrich book) → The Social Network.
The film is technically an adapted screenplay but the speakers say Sorkin was working from the same research and the book proposal, not using the book as a template.
“But it's basically like this movie is using the same research that the book has called rather than Aaron Sorkin reading this book and using it as a template if that makes sense.”
“One point Fincher was attached to a movie called Seared, which later becomes a television show called Kitchen Confidential, because it is based on Anthony Bourdain's writing.”
unmapped (obsessive detail):
The Social Network → Zodiac.
Fincher's Bex for the beer in The Social Network is linked to his stickler's hunt for the pen Graysmith would have used in Zodiac.
“I remember reading some piece about zodiac when it came out and they talked about him being a stickler about like, what is the actual pen that Robert Graysmith would have used at his desk.”
unmapped (many takes):
David Fincher → Stanley Kubrick.
Fincher's 100 takes are compared to Kubrick as a search for something that surprises the director, not a fixed target.
“It's sort of, much like we talked about, Kubrick, where it's like, he's not doing 100 takes looking for them to achieve a thing he's waiting for.”
people (first-choice director):
Michael Mann → Shame (The Motels video).
Martha Davis first wanted Michael Mann (after The Keep); he was unavailable and her agent suggested Fincher.
“originally expressed interest in working with Michael Mann after seeing his 1983 film The Keep.”
lineage (visual homage):
All That Jazz → Cold Hearted (Paula Abdul video).
A host reads that Cold Hearted was inspired by All That Jazz, and another says it directly references it.
“this film was uh, inspired by all that jazz, her belly button's exposed.”
unmapped (carried-over injury):
Moulin Rouge! → Panic Room.
Kidman's knee was injured on Moulin Rouge and not healed, and she reinjured it on Panic Room.
“The whole thing with her knee was that she had actually injured at making Milan Rouge and not known.”
theme (comparison (Fincher's words)):
Nicole Kidman → Grace Kelly.
Fincher compares Kidman to Grace Kelly, glamour and physicality, versus Foster, who is about her eyes.
“as Fincher puts it, you know, your, you know, Nicole Kidman, Grace Kelly.”
unmapped (formative pick):
Alex Ross Perry → Fight Club.
Perry's last three picks are called the building blocks of his entire personality, Fight Club among them.
“It's a new trilogy of movies that basically are the building blocks of your entire personality.”
theme (dismissed comparison):
The Game → The Most Dangerous Game.
Fincher first wondered if the script was a Most Dangerous Game thing, and was relieved it wasn't.
“oh, is it like a most dangerous game kind of thing?”
unmapped (template):
The Game → A Christmas Carol.
Fincher's own framing, as quoted in the dossier, is that The Game is A Christmas Carol and Nick is Scrooge.
fun, about
Doctor Sleep (title):
The title comes from Danny's humane way of easing people dying in a hospice, a minor thread; some say it should have been Shining 2.
“It's funny that the title of the movie comes from like his very humane way of helping people be at ease before they die, a very sort of minor plot thread.”
fun, about
A Clockwork Orange:
Kubrick pulled the film from Britain a year after release and it stayed out until his death; it was banned in Ireland until 1999.
fun, about
A Clockwork Orange:
McDowell scratched his cornea during the eyedrop scenes and the numbing wore off in the car; a speed bump felt like a razor blade.
fun, about
Dr. Strangelove:
The release was delayed by the Kennedy assassination; a speaker also notes the President is the last reasonable president in an American satire, because Kennedy was in office.
“this movie was delayed because of the assassination of Kennedy.”
fun, about
Terry Southern:
Sellers gave Kubrick The Magic Christian, which brought Southern in; the dossier read is that Kubrick wrote it, George inspired it, and Southern made it funny.
“JJ's read on the screenplay, though, is that it's Dubrick wrote it.”
fun, about
Dr. Strangelove:
The first page of the screenplay says the story will be played for realistic comedy and the acting will never be so-called comedy acting.
“The 1st page of the screenplay says, the story will be played for realistic comedy”
fun, about
Gene Kelly:
The original plan for Jack D. Ripper was Gene Kelly. Kubrick then cast George C. Scott, who asked to play Turgidson instead, and brought in Sterling Hayden.
“You know who the original plan was to cast for Jack D. Ripper, the Sterling Hayden Row?”
fun, about
James Earl Jones:
Jones had a big role questioning the mission; Kubrick decided he did not want the protesting crew member to be a Black actor and cut it. Jones told him he took the part for the cut material.
“eventually Kubrick decided he didn't want the guy protesting to be a black guy and cuts everything out.”
fun, about
Dr. Strangelove:
Kubrick wrote down about thirty alternate titles, including Wonderful Bomb, Dr. Doomsday, and Dr. Strangelove's Secret Uses of Uranus.
“The weird one is Dr. Strangelove's secret uses of Uranus.”
fun, about
Kirk Douglas:
In Munich the rewritten script had a happy ending; Douglas threatened to walk. Kubrick calmly said he wanted a commercial hit.
fun, about
Kola Kwariani (Nick the Wrestler):
A former wrestler Kubrick met through chess circles, he died at 77 after fighting five teenagers outside his chess club.
“He was 76 years old and he was leaving his regular chess club where he played and he was jumped by 5 teenagers”
fun, about
Fear and Desire:
The poster sells a 'half animal girl' with an illustration of a kissed neck, making the war movie look supernatural.
“An illustration of, uh, Paul Mizurski kissing her neck that makes it look consensual, and says, fear and desire, trapped for desperate man, and a strange half animal girl.”
fun, about
Alien: Covenant:
Originally titled Alien: Paradise Lost; Damon Lindelof was going to write it before bailing, then John Logan, with a first script by the Transcendence writer and a Michael Green rewrite.
“Initially, it was going to be called Alien Paradise Lost.”
fun, about
Ridley Scott:
Scott gave interviews saying there would be no aliens or xenomorphs, then reversed; the hosts wonder if it was him or the studio telling him to put aliens in.
“initially Scott was giving these interviews where he was like, there won't be aliens”
fun, about
Alien: Covenant:
The online prologue with James Franco and Noomi Rapace is not in the film; the initial cut ran about 2.5 hours and Scott trimmed the franchise stuff.
“it was this thing with James Franco, who is not in this movie, although you see him in like photos.”
fun, about
Ron Perlman:
The basketball shot: Weaver actually sank it over her shoulder on a quick take and Perlman's reaction is real; no visual effects.
fun, about
Sigourney Weaver:
Weaver would not let toys be made with guns for years; Resurrection was the only time, and no collector figure for 15 years after.
“one of the key reasons was because she didn't want her action figures coming with guns.”
fun, about
You've Got Mail:
The box office for December 18, 1998: You've Got Mail at number one, ahead of Prince of Egypt, A Bug's Life, Star Trek: Insurrection, and Jack Frost.
“So number one, though, it's you've got mail, $18 million.”
fun, about
Jack Frost:
The animatronic Jack Frost snowman was built from the likeness of George Clooney, who dropped out late; Michael Keaton replaced him.
“But they built it off of the likeness of the actor who was supposed to play the title role who dropped out very late.”